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	<title>Comments on: Experimental Amateur Built Aircraft &amp; the NTSB</title>
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	<link>http://blog.aopa.org/leadingedge/?p=2653</link>
	<description>A place to discuss safety-of-flight issues, procedures, techniques, and judgment.</description>
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		<title>By: William Crowl</title>
		<link>http://blog.aopa.org/leadingedge/?p=2653&#038;cpage=1#comment-45907</link>
		<dc:creator>William Crowl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 26 May 2012 14:10:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.aopa.org/leadingedge/?p=2653#comment-45907</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I have to agree with the comments that we live in an era of regulation for regulations sake and that a select few are oppressing the many with their obsession for regulation to justify their position as regulators.

But there is another issue that keeps escaping notice that is driving me up the wall.  Accident statistics only make sense when they are converted to a ratio (rate) relative to proximal cause.  It makes no sense to consider falls in the bathtub per units of toast consumed and it is silly to do so.  It makes very little sense to measure aviation accidents by unit time, say flight hours and it is ridiculous to measure EXPERIMENTAL aircraft accidents by calendar year and doing so reveals an agenda.

If the NTSB, FAA et al were serious about comparative accident rate they would measure it by flight operation (one take off, one landing) because that is the proximal cause, aircraft operation.  They would also include fatalities per incident in their evaluation because this would give a clear indication of the level of hazard to the general population.

However, this will NEVER happen because to do so would reveal that most civil aircraft including EXPERIMENTAL aircraft spend a lot of time on short hop flights or performing touch and go landings and run up flight cycles like crazy.  Compare this directly to airline operation where there may be many hours between take off and landing and hundreds of people will die in a single fatal event and suddenly you have a very different &quot;safety&quot; statistic.  

The AOPA and EAA need to stop accepting purposefully skewed government safety statistics if they want to have any credibility with their constituencies on this issue.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have to agree with the comments that we live in an era of regulation for regulations sake and that a select few are oppressing the many with their obsession for regulation to justify their position as regulators.</p>
<p>But there is another issue that keeps escaping notice that is driving me up the wall.  Accident statistics only make sense when they are converted to a ratio (rate) relative to proximal cause.  It makes no sense to consider falls in the bathtub per units of toast consumed and it is silly to do so.  It makes very little sense to measure aviation accidents by unit time, say flight hours and it is ridiculous to measure EXPERIMENTAL aircraft accidents by calendar year and doing so reveals an agenda.</p>
<p>If the NTSB, FAA et al were serious about comparative accident rate they would measure it by flight operation (one take off, one landing) because that is the proximal cause, aircraft operation.  They would also include fatalities per incident in their evaluation because this would give a clear indication of the level of hazard to the general population.</p>
<p>However, this will NEVER happen because to do so would reveal that most civil aircraft including EXPERIMENTAL aircraft spend a lot of time on short hop flights or performing touch and go landings and run up flight cycles like crazy.  Compare this directly to airline operation where there may be many hours between take off and landing and hundreds of people will die in a single fatal event and suddenly you have a very different &#8220;safety&#8221; statistic.  </p>
<p>The AOPA and EAA need to stop accepting purposefully skewed government safety statistics if they want to have any credibility with their constituencies on this issue.</p>
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		<title>By: john</title>
		<link>http://blog.aopa.org/leadingedge/?p=2653&#038;cpage=1#comment-45906</link>
		<dc:creator>john</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 26 May 2012 13:23:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.aopa.org/leadingedge/?p=2653#comment-45906</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I believe the entire GA private owned aircraft industry is over regulated and innovation stifled by FAA regulations.  I do not feel that the FAA should adopt any new regulations.  However, I do feel that better education for builders would be good.  The FAA should create a consolidated summary of all EAB and certified type incidents and make this readily available to EAB builders.  this document organized by aircraft type and system would be a very useful source of information to help builders avoid the mistakes made by others.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I believe the entire GA private owned aircraft industry is over regulated and innovation stifled by FAA regulations.  I do not feel that the FAA should adopt any new regulations.  However, I do feel that better education for builders would be good.  The FAA should create a consolidated summary of all EAB and certified type incidents and make this readily available to EAB builders.  this document organized by aircraft type and system would be a very useful source of information to help builders avoid the mistakes made by others.</p>
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		<title>By: William</title>
		<link>http://blog.aopa.org/leadingedge/?p=2653&#038;cpage=1#comment-45905</link>
		<dc:creator>William</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 26 May 2012 12:40:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.aopa.org/leadingedge/?p=2653#comment-45905</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Transition training is required by insurance co.s for most pilots flying a homebuilt that they don&#039;t have any hours in therefore there is no need for the FAA to get involved. The government can&#039;t regulate safety , but they can regulate expermentals out of existence and that&#039;s what they will end up doing over the years to come if they are allowed to start expanding regulations in the name of safety.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Transition training is required by insurance co.s for most pilots flying a homebuilt that they don&#8217;t have any hours in therefore there is no need for the FAA to get involved. The government can&#8217;t regulate safety , but they can regulate expermentals out of existence and that&#8217;s what they will end up doing over the years to come if they are allowed to start expanding regulations in the name of safety.</p>
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		<title>By: Harvey Havir</title>
		<link>http://blog.aopa.org/leadingedge/?p=2653&#038;cpage=1#comment-45900</link>
		<dc:creator>Harvey Havir</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 26 May 2012 05:23:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.aopa.org/leadingedge/?p=2653#comment-45900</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[If the FAA want more pilots to have transition training when they complete or purchase their new aircraft, they will have to figure out a system to allow pilots to pay for that training in a closely related E-AB aircraft. I am getting an RV-12 and there is only one aircraft in the entire United States (Oregon) where I was able to purchase transition training! All owners (friends?) are not instructor qualified and regulations prohibit compensation for very obvious expenses. If the FAA remains inflexible to approving  a way to make transition training more available in the E-AB world, we will continue to test the pilots and their aircraft simultaneously.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If the FAA want more pilots to have transition training when they complete or purchase their new aircraft, they will have to figure out a system to allow pilots to pay for that training in a closely related E-AB aircraft. I am getting an RV-12 and there is only one aircraft in the entire United States (Oregon) where I was able to purchase transition training! All owners (friends?) are not instructor qualified and regulations prohibit compensation for very obvious expenses. If the FAA remains inflexible to approving  a way to make transition training more available in the E-AB world, we will continue to test the pilots and their aircraft simultaneously.</p>
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		<title>By: Robin Shaw</title>
		<link>http://blog.aopa.org/leadingedge/?p=2653&#038;cpage=1#comment-45896</link>
		<dc:creator>Robin Shaw</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 May 2012 23:31:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.aopa.org/leadingedge/?p=2653#comment-45896</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[When the Government acquired the power to &quot;Regulate&quot; the meaning of the word was: To keep regular and uninhibited.
Today, &quot;regulators&quot; think the word means: To choke, stymie and stifle.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When the Government acquired the power to &#8220;Regulate&#8221; the meaning of the word was: To keep regular and uninhibited.<br />
Today, &#8220;regulators&#8221; think the word means: To choke, stymie and stifle.</p>
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		<title>By: Jerry Clark</title>
		<link>http://blog.aopa.org/leadingedge/?p=2653&#038;cpage=1#comment-45892</link>
		<dc:creator>Jerry Clark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 May 2012 20:31:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.aopa.org/leadingedge/?p=2653#comment-45892</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I&#039;ve been a CFI for 40 years and the best thing that could be done to help the experimental pilotsI know,  is to allow a CFI to fly with the pilot during the 40 hour fly off.  This puts an extra set of eyes on the preflight and provides a helper when recording  performance data.  It also provides advice from someone with more flying experience while the pilot adjusts to a new aircraft.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve been a CFI for 40 years and the best thing that could be done to help the experimental pilotsI know,  is to allow a CFI to fly with the pilot during the 40 hour fly off.  This puts an extra set of eyes on the preflight and provides a helper when recording  performance data.  It also provides advice from someone with more flying experience while the pilot adjusts to a new aircraft.</p>
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		<title>By: Gordon Helm</title>
		<link>http://blog.aopa.org/leadingedge/?p=2653&#038;cpage=1#comment-45888</link>
		<dc:creator>Gordon Helm</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 May 2012 18:14:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.aopa.org/leadingedge/?p=2653#comment-45888</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I also support education over regulation.  I can see considering additional requirements for kit-built aircraft because those companies are in business to make a profit on an aircraft they have designed and produced the components to complete.  While labeled experimental, they approach the level of an aircraft manufacturing company. A true experimental aircraft, built by an individual, is different.  Placing unreasonable restrictions on this class of aircraft development stymies America&#039;s Yankee ingenuity and reduces the American inventiveness that separates us from many other countries.  Increasing the number of regulations and laws makes things more complicated, and many will forgo an activity if it seems too burdensome to complete.   This proposed action by the NTSB, while well intentioned, seems to be more of the same. More education, please.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I also support education over regulation.  I can see considering additional requirements for kit-built aircraft because those companies are in business to make a profit on an aircraft they have designed and produced the components to complete.  While labeled experimental, they approach the level of an aircraft manufacturing company. A true experimental aircraft, built by an individual, is different.  Placing unreasonable restrictions on this class of aircraft development stymies America&#8217;s Yankee ingenuity and reduces the American inventiveness that separates us from many other countries.  Increasing the number of regulations and laws makes things more complicated, and many will forgo an activity if it seems too burdensome to complete.   This proposed action by the NTSB, while well intentioned, seems to be more of the same. More education, please.</p>
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		<title>By: kevin lane</title>
		<link>http://blog.aopa.org/leadingedge/?p=2653&#038;cpage=1#comment-45887</link>
		<dc:creator>kevin lane</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 May 2012 17:55:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.aopa.org/leadingedge/?p=2653#comment-45887</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[besides accidents per flight hour, they need to address the nature of the flights.  i would guess that the accident rate for high performance cars is greater than that of say, family mini vans.  this doesn&#039;t mean that mini vans are safer.  i agree with education improvements.
i will also point out there seems to be an assumption that certified planes always are &quot;right&quot;.  the T-craft i learned in had no shoulder harnesses. the fuel tank above your knees was prone to leaking and had been fixed many times.  not so in my RV.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>besides accidents per flight hour, they need to address the nature of the flights.  i would guess that the accident rate for high performance cars is greater than that of say, family mini vans.  this doesn&#8217;t mean that mini vans are safer.  i agree with education improvements.<br />
i will also point out there seems to be an assumption that certified planes always are &#8220;right&#8221;.  the T-craft i learned in had no shoulder harnesses. the fuel tank above your knees was prone to leaking and had been fixed many times.  not so in my RV.</p>
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		<title>By: Jim Hanson</title>
		<link>http://blog.aopa.org/leadingedge/?p=2653&#038;cpage=1#comment-45883</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Hanson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 May 2012 16:39:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.aopa.org/leadingedge/?p=2653#comment-45883</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Rather than ruin the EXPERIMENTAL nature of experimentals--let&#039;s focus on where the problem lies, with the PILOTS not the airplanes.  I&#039;m a homebuilder--an FBO, and fly airplanes, helicopters, jets, balloons, and gliders.  

If there is an issue with experimental accidents, it is often because pilots spend so much time BUILDING the aircraft that they often don&#039;t maintain proficiency, or bother to gain proficiency with the unique flight characteristics of the aircraft.

If you are going to regulate--make the owner/pilot of the aircraft demonstrate that they are familiar with the systems and unique flight characteristics of the aircraft.  This need not be much more than what is required on a biennial flight reveiw--in fact, the checkout would QUALIFY as a BFR.

Possible subjects--aircraft systems--especially fuel and non-certificated powerplants.  The effects of high and low wing loading.  The effect of low aircraft mass on glide characteristics.  A checkout like this may have saved John Denver (fuel-related in a new-to-him aircraft).  As always, EAA could take a leadership role in developing a suggested checkout.

Let&#039;s put the emphasis on where the problem lies (pilots) and the cure for the problem (education, not regulation).]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rather than ruin the EXPERIMENTAL nature of experimentals&#8211;let&#8217;s focus on where the problem lies, with the PILOTS not the airplanes.  I&#8217;m a homebuilder&#8211;an FBO, and fly airplanes, helicopters, jets, balloons, and gliders.  </p>
<p>If there is an issue with experimental accidents, it is often because pilots spend so much time BUILDING the aircraft that they often don&#8217;t maintain proficiency, or bother to gain proficiency with the unique flight characteristics of the aircraft.</p>
<p>If you are going to regulate&#8211;make the owner/pilot of the aircraft demonstrate that they are familiar with the systems and unique flight characteristics of the aircraft.  This need not be much more than what is required on a biennial flight reveiw&#8211;in fact, the checkout would QUALIFY as a BFR.</p>
<p>Possible subjects&#8211;aircraft systems&#8211;especially fuel and non-certificated powerplants.  The effects of high and low wing loading.  The effect of low aircraft mass on glide characteristics.  A checkout like this may have saved John Denver (fuel-related in a new-to-him aircraft).  As always, EAA could take a leadership role in developing a suggested checkout.</p>
<p>Let&#8217;s put the emphasis on where the problem lies (pilots) and the cure for the problem (education, not regulation).</p>
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		<title>By: Stanford</title>
		<link>http://blog.aopa.org/leadingedge/?p=2653&#038;cpage=1#comment-45882</link>
		<dc:creator>Stanford</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 May 2012 16:26:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.aopa.org/leadingedge/?p=2653#comment-45882</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Here&#039;s a poll.  Let&#039;s assume the FAA implements new FAR&#039;s to address the NTSB recommendations.  Please raise your hand if you believe those are the last regulations to be proposed for E-AB aircraft, and if you believe that regulations will become fewer as time goes on.  Anyone?  

Flying, like walking, is inherently risky.  For those of you who are not physics majors, that&#039;s because you are moving.  Safety is NOT the highest priority.  If it was, we would all stay in bed all day long (without a partner).  The highest priority is to achieve an objective, while understanding and possibly minimizing the risk.  Sometimes that objective is just to have fun.  And sometimes having fun means conciously increasing the risk of the activity.

So maybe instead of more restrictive regulations, what we need is a placard on the side of the aircraft that lists the risk for that particular type of aircraft, compared with a widely accepted risk, such as driving a car in Washington DC (withour a chauffeur - I know that will be difficult to relate to for NTSB and FAA types, but so be it.)

But if we&#039;re going to do that, I insist we also do it for every new car sold.  That&#039;s right, I big ole placard right on each door telling people how likely they are to die in that car.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here&#8217;s a poll.  Let&#8217;s assume the FAA implements new FAR&#8217;s to address the NTSB recommendations.  Please raise your hand if you believe those are the last regulations to be proposed for E-AB aircraft, and if you believe that regulations will become fewer as time goes on.  Anyone?  </p>
<p>Flying, like walking, is inherently risky.  For those of you who are not physics majors, that&#8217;s because you are moving.  Safety is NOT the highest priority.  If it was, we would all stay in bed all day long (without a partner).  The highest priority is to achieve an objective, while understanding and possibly minimizing the risk.  Sometimes that objective is just to have fun.  And sometimes having fun means conciously increasing the risk of the activity.</p>
<p>So maybe instead of more restrictive regulations, what we need is a placard on the side of the aircraft that lists the risk for that particular type of aircraft, compared with a widely accepted risk, such as driving a car in Washington DC (withour a chauffeur &#8211; I know that will be difficult to relate to for NTSB and FAA types, but so be it.)</p>
<p>But if we&#8217;re going to do that, I insist we also do it for every new car sold.  That&#8217;s right, I big ole placard right on each door telling people how likely they are to die in that car.</p>
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